HomeMy WebLinkAboutREED Lots 12, 13 & 14st0
Sandra J. Wicks
Attorney at Law
608 West 4th Avenue #22
Anchorage, Alaska 99501
(907) ~.~-~ 258-6387
April 4, 1986
Mr. Bill Mans, Acting Division Manager
Environmental Health Division
Department of Health and Human Services
Municipality of Anchorage
P.O.Box 196650
Anchorage, Alaska 99519-6650
Subject: Well Permits for Lots 12, 13 and 14,
Reed Subdivision
Dear Bill:
Thanks to you and Susan Oswalt for taking the time to meet
with Finis Shelden, Lee Reid and myself at the offices of the
State Department of Environmental Conservation on April 3,
1986. I think it was important for all of us to meet with the
various DEC staff members who are involved in this matter~ the
details of which are spelled out in my letter to Bruce Erickson,
the Anchorage/Western District Offices Coordinator for DEC. I
have attached a copy of that letter to this one.
I hope that as a result of our meeting all of us will be
working toward a reasonable solution of the problem that will
protect the public health and yet not cause undue consternation
or dislocation to the owners of the lots involved. I believe you
agreed that as long as we are working toward a solution, it will
not be necessary at this time to involve the owners of Lots 13
and 14 or financial institutions that may have made loans on
those lots. I am concerned to not disrupt the lives of the
owners of Lots 13 and 14 and not to indirectly have any
aspersions cast on Mr. Shelden's reputation, either as a builder
or as a realtor. He, in good faith, constructed three private
wells on Lot 14 after submitting the plans to and receiving the
approval of DEC. His reputation should not be made to suffer
because DEC has now decided it did not have the jurisdiction to
issue the permits. If it becomes necessary to apply to the State
for a public well permit, we will involve the owners of Lots 13
and 14 at that time.
Bill Mans
Well Permits
April 4, 1986
Page 2
At this time, before any decision can be made to apply to
the State for a public well permit or to the Municipality for
three private well permits, two issues must be resolved, one by
the State and one by the Municipality.
The State must determine whether the three existing wells on
Lot 14, designed and constructed as private wells to separately
serve Lots 12, 13 and 14, in fact, constitute one public well.
The Municipality needs to determine whether a lot can be
served by a private well that is constructed on some other lot.
We recognize that that is not the normal case, but do not read
the Code as prohibiting a private well on one lot serving another
lot. Of course, it would be necessary to clearly identify the
lot on which the well was located and the lot to be served by the
well. It is also necessary to have recorded easements to allow
access to the well and water and electric lines. All of that was
done in this case.
Specifically, in this case, there are three wells on Lot
14. One well serves Lot 14. One well serves Lot 13 and one well
serves rot 12. There are separate water snd electrical lines
from Lot 12's well to Lot 12, from Lot 13's well to Lot 13 and
from Lot 14's well to the house on Lot 14. There are easements
providing Lots 12 and 13 access to their wells and water and
electric lines. By having separate wells, in this manner, there
need not be any coordination between property owners for water
sampling and costs of repair or maintenance. Each property owner
is responsible for his/her own well. My question is whether this
type of arrangement is prohibited by the Anchorage Municipal
Code. It does not appear to us that it is.
Furthermore, as a common sense matter, This situation seems
very analogous to the situation where a building of a certain
size cannot be built on a lot unless adequate parking can be
provided on an adjacent lot. That is done regularly by recording
a parking agreement that acts as an easement on the adjacent
property providing the parking space.
It also seems a matter of common sense, where a lot has been
shadowed by the radii from surrounding septic systems, that a
well be drilled on another lot to serve the shadowed lot. By
that means the lot is not rendered unbuildable by the actions of
neighboring lot owners in the placement of their septic systems.
Sandra J. Wicks
Attorney at Law
608 West 4th Avenue #22
Anchorage, Alaska 99501
(907)X~(~2X 258-6387
Apr il 4, 1986
Mr. Bruce E. Erickson
District Offices Coordinator
Anc~horage/Western District Office
Alaska Department of Environmental Conservation
437 E. Street, Suite 303
Anchorage, Alaska 99501
Subject:
Lots 12, 13 & 14, Reed Subdivision,
Private Wells, Chugiak, Alaska
Dear Mr. Erickson:
I appreciate the time you and your staff members took to
meet with Finis Shelden, Lee Reid and myself, as well as Susan
Oswalt and Bill Mans from the Municipality, on April 3, 1986.
The purpose of this letter is to summarize my understanding of
what was discussed at the meeting.
I explained to those present that Lots 12, 13 and 14,
Reed Subdivision, are shadowed by the septic systems on adjacent
lots, particularly those lots to the south in George Sehm
Addition. Enclosed are the illustrations of the problem that I
distributed at our meeting.
Susan Oswalt pointed out Municipal permits were issued
in May, 1985 for individual wells on Lots 12, 13 and 14. Lee
Reid explained that when he became involved he realized there was
no way to put wells on Lots 12 and 13 without violating the
required 100 foot separation distance. Having worked on the
drafting of the Municipal Code provisions relating to wells, and
having had long experience in the administration of those
provisions, he was aware of no prohibition against drilling 3
separate wells on Lot 14 to serve Lots 12, 13 and 14. He drew
the necessary plans and presented them to the Municipality.
Susan says that she told Lee to go to the State -- the
implication being that he should apply for a public well
permit. Lee says his impression was that the Municipality did
not want to review anything but the standard on-site well
design. He was not told to apply for a public well permit. So
he took his plans for three separate private wells to DEC.
Mr. Bruce E. Eri~ ,on
Private Wells - Reed Subdivision
April 4, 1986
Page 2
The plans and specifications were reviewed and approved
by Steve Eng of DEC in a letter dated June 12, 1985. A copy of
that letter is attached. During the summer of 1985 the wells for
Lots 12, 13 and 14 were installed in reliance on the DEC
permits. The septic systems were installed pursuant to Municipal
permits. Houses were built on Lots 13 and 14 and have been
sold. The water syst ems for Lots 1 3 and 14 were issued
Certificates to Operate by Michael P. Lewis of DEC on October 11,
1985. A copy of that letter is also attached. A Certificate to
Operate for Lot 12 was not applied for until March, 1986 as no
house had been built on the lot.
On March 6, 1986 you wrote to the Municipality that the
approvals granted by your office for the wells on Lots 12, 13 and
14 were invalid because your office does not have the authority
to approve private wells in the Municipality. I have attached a
copy of that letter also. Unfortunately, the citation in that
letter is not precise enough for me to verify that your office
does not have the authority to approve private wells in the
Municipality. I raised the question at the meeting, but did not
receive a satisfactory answer, whether DEC, in fact, is without
jurisdiction or whether DEC, as a matter of practicer defers to
the Municipality when the Municipality wishes to assume
jurisdiction. That, of course, will be an important question
should we ever have to go to court over the validity or
invalidity of the permits issued by the State.
I hasten to add, after my previous comment, however,
that it is not our desire to go to court over this matter. In
our meeting, I continually stressed our desire to simply sort out
the tangled threads in this matter and make sure that Lots 12, 13
and 14 have a safe and legal water supply. We would prefer,
however, that the three wells continue to be treated as private
wells so that the three separate property owners need not have to
coordinate the taking of water samples and costs of repair and
maintenance.
That, I believe summarizes the background to the
problem. Now what is the solution?
Bill Mans raised the question at our meeting whether the
Municipal Code permits a lot to be served by a private off-site
well as in this case. We do not believe the Municipal Code
prohibits the design created by Lee to solve the shadowing
problem. I have written to Bill requesting a formal
determination on that issue. You will find a copy of my letter
to Bill attached hereto. If off-site private wells are
prohibited, there is no .option other than to apply to DEC for a
public well permit since it is impossible to put private on-site
wells on Lots 12 and 13.
Mr. Bruce E. Ericks_n
Private Wells - Reed Subdivision
April 4, 1986
Page 3
There is also the question raised by DEC whether three
wells five feet apart that go to the same depth really constitute
a public well. Jim Hayden of your office was going to pursue
this question and provide us a written explanation. We pointed
out that there are many examples of private wells that all tap
the same acquifer (called a "public water source" by the
September, 1985 Attorney General's opinion). Presumably, not all
wells drilled into the same "public water source" are public
wells. There are also many examples of private on-site wells
where the driller drilled on one side of a lot line and then
pulled the rig a short distance across the lot line and drilled
another well into the same "public water source". The presence
of a surface boundary line should presumably not affect your
conclusion whether these two separate wells are private wells or
one public well. I think the decision about what constitutes a
public well should be very carefully made unless DEC suddenly
wants to convert a lot of private wells into public wells.
My understanding from both you and Bill Mans is that it
will take some time to obtain the necessary clarifications and
that, in the meantime, neither DEC nor DHHS will stir up
unnecessary anxiety in the property owners or financial
institutions affected.
After the necessary clarifications have been obtained,
we will then know what our choices are. They appear to be to
apply to the Municipality for three separate private well permits
or to apply to the State for a public well permit covering all
three wells. Of course, I do not waive the right to assert the
validity of the current permits, but that is a position of last
recourse at this time.
Regardless of which type of permit is finally obtained
for these wells, some safety issues raised by Steve Eng in his
letter dated March 27, 1986 also need to be addressed. A copy of
his letter is attached. It identifies two concerns:
drainage toward the wells, and
danger of the wells being struck by vehicles.
We agree that these concerns should be researched and resolved.
If there is, in fact, a ponding problem, it may be necessary to
raise the ground level around the wells. We know that the road
maintenance crews have plowed the road onto Lot 14's property
and, therefore, unreasonably close to the wells. It may be
Mr. Bruce E. Erick~n
Private Wells - Reed Subdivision
April 4, 1986
Page 4
necessary to erect a barricade or markers to indicate the
property line and protect the wells. As can be seen on the
attached as-built, the wells are at least 5 feet in from the
property line. Neither plows nor snow from the road should be in
that 5 feet. We will be looking into these two areas of concern
while DEC and DHHS are obtaining answers to their respective
questions.
I would like to stress that the wells on Lots 12, 13 and
14 were designed and constructed in good faith after consultation
with DHHS and DEC and pursuant to permits issued by DEC. The
houses on Lots 13 and 14 and all of the wells and septic systems
were constructed in reliance on those permits. A great deal of
money and numerous people's well-being are at stake here. Mr.
Shelden and Dr. Reid have at all times attempted to cooperate
with DEC and DHHS on this well question and will continue to do
so. We hope that DEC and DHHS will similarly act in good faith
and in a cooperative manner to resolve this matter.
Sincerely,~_~~~, ~~
Sandra J. Wick~s
SJW/ja
Enclosures
cc: Finis Shelden
Lee Reid, Alaska Environmental Control Services, Inc.
Mayor Tony Knowles
Assemblyman Gerry O'Connor
Assemblyman Fred Dyson
Assemblyman John Woods
Bill Mans, DHHS
Susan Oswalt, DHHS
Jim Hayden, DEC
Mike Lewis, DEC
Steve Eng, DEC
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CONTROL SERVIr?c3, INC.,
! 200 West'3'3rd Aver,~v Suite' B
ANCHORAGE, ALASKA 99503
Phone 561.5040
SHEET NO
CALCULATED BY _~) ~
CHECKED DY.
I : ~
OF
ALASKA ENVIRONMENTAL
CONTROL SERVICES, INC.
1200 West 33rd Aven~e, Suite B
ANCHORAGE, ALASKA 99503
(9O7) 561.5040
OF
DATE
DATE
1
AS--BUILT
I hereby certify that LOT /~-
Anchorage Recording 3istrict, Alaska, has been surveyed by me and
that no encroachments exist except as .shown hereon. It is the
responsibility of the owner to determine the existence of any
easements, covenants, or restrictions which do not appear on the
recorded subdivision plat. Listed distances prevail and scaling
should not be attempted to determine unshown dimensions. This
survey is not adequate for, nor should it be used for
establishing boundary or fence lines.
LAND SURVEY COMPANY
P.O. Box 671089
Chugiak, Alaska 99567
Phone (907) 688-4499
DEPT. OF EN%'IRONMENTAL CONSER%:&TION~9~,FLE -i: .... "~, ..~'~:-
ANCHORAGE/WESTERN DISTRICT OFFICE
437 "E" STREET, SUiTE 303
ANCHORAGE, ALASKA 99501 274-2533
March 27, 1986
Alaska Environmental Control
Services, Inc.
1200 West 33rd Avenue, Suite B
Anchorage, Alaska 99503
SUBJECT: Lot 12, Reed Subdivision, Private Well, Anchorage
Alaska 8621-DS-024 & 8621-FA-211
Dear Sir:
The Department has reviewed the subject submittal. As can be
seen by the attached letter, our department does not have the
authority to approve private wells within the Hunicipality o¢
Anchorage.
The subject
Harch 24,
the 3
¢looded
Surface
systems
hazard.
uells
snowplow.
wells to
approvals
inspection.
property was inspected by department personnel on
1986. We have grave concerns over the location o~
wells on Lot 14, Reed Subdivision. The wells are in a
area which is in direct violation o~ 18 AAC 80.020.
waters were observed ?lowing Crom an area with septic
tooard the well depressions creating a potential health
In addition, the location is such that damage to the
can easily result Crom large vehicles such as a
We have serious doubts as to the ability o~ the
properly per¢orm in their present location. Any
previously granted are rescinded as a result o~ this
Sincerely,
SWE:pkk
cc: Bruce Erickson, ADEC, Anchorage
Jim Hayden, A/WDO
MOA/DHHS
LASKA ENVIRONI~ ITAL S,E.~ No Or
1200 West 33rd Awnu~-~'Suite B
ANCHORAGF. ALASKA 99503 CH~CKEO "Y- O~TE
(907) 561-5040
~ 2
Al o P.'~ H vv' o o u> $
~u~3DIVI $ I OA~
TR.4CT C-I
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Sandra J. Wicks
Attorney at Law
608 West 4th Avenue #22
Anchorage, Alaska 99501
(90 7) gflSK6718Yx 258-6387
April 4, 1986
Mr. Bruce E. Erickson
District Offices Coordinator
Anc.horage/Western District Office
Alaska, Department of Environmental Conservation
437 E. Street, Suite 303
Anchorage, Alaska 99501
Subject:
Lots 12, 13 & 14, Reed Subdivision,
Private Wells, Chugiak, Alaska
Dear Mr. Erickson:
I appreciate the time you and your staff members took to
meet with Finis Shelden, Lee Reid and myself, as well as Susan
Oswalt and Bill Mans from the Municipality, on April 3, 1986.
The purpose of this letter is to summarize my understanding of
what was discussed at the meeting.
I explained to those present that Lots 12, 13 and 14,
Reed Subdivisions- are shadowed by the septic systems on adjacent
lots, particularly those lots to the south in George Sehm
Addition. Enclosed are the illustrations of the problem that I
distributed at our meeting.
Susan Oswalt pointed out Municipal permits were issued
in May, 1985 for individual wells on Lots 12, 13 and 14. Lee
Reid explained that when he became involved he realized there was
no way to put wells on Lots 12 and 13 without violating the
required 100 foot separation distance. Having worked on the
drafting of the Municipal Code provisions relating to wells, and
having had long experience in the administration of those
provisions, he was aware of no prohibition against drilling 3
separate wells on Lot 14 to serve Lots 12, 13 and 14. He drew
the necessary plans and presented them to the Municipality.
Susan says that she told Lee to go to the State -- the
implication being that he should apply for a public well
permit. Lee says his impression was that the Municipality did
not want to review anything but the standard on-site well
design. He was not told to apply for a public well permit. So
he took his plans for three separate private wells to DEC.
Mr. Bruce E. Eric on
Private Wells - Reed Subdivision
April 4, 1986
Page 2
The plans and specifications were reviewed and approved
by Steve Eng of DEC in a letter dated June 12, 1985. A copy of
that letter is attached. During the summer .of 1985 the wells for
Lots 12, 13 and 14 were installed in reliance on the DEC
permits. The septic systems were installed pursuant to Municipal
permits. Houses were built on Lots 13 and 14 and have been
sold. The water systems for Lots 13 and 14 were issued
Certificates to Operate by Michael P. Lewis of DEC on October 11,
1985. A copy of that letter is also attached. A Certificate to
Operate for Lot 12 was not applied for until March, 1986 as no
house had been built on the lot.
On March 6, 1986 you wrote to the Municipality that the
approvals granted by your office for the wells on Lots 12, 13 and
14 were invalid because your office does not have the authority
to approve private wells in the Municipality. I have attached a
copy of that letter also. Unfortunately, the citation in that
letter is not precise enough for me to verify that your office
does not have the authority to approve private wells in the
Municipality. I raised the question at the meeting, but did not
receive a satisfactory answer, whether DEC, in fact, is without
jurisdiction or whether DEC, as a matter of practicej defers to
the Municipality when the Municipality wishes to assume
jurisdiction. That, of course, will be an important question
should we ever have to go to court over the validity or
invalidity of the permits issued by the State.
I hasten to add, after my previous comment, however,
that it is not our desire to go to court over this matter. In
our meeting, I continually stressed our desire to simply sort out
the tangled threads in this matter and make sure that Lots 12, 13
and 14 have a safe and legal water supply. We would prefer,
however, that the three wells continue to be treated as private
wells so that the three separate property owners need not have to
coordinate the taking of water samples and costs of repair and
maintenance.
That, I believe summarizes the background to the
problem. Now what is the solution?
Bill Mans raised the question at our meeting whether the
Municipal Code permits a lot to be served by a private off-site
well as in this case. We do not believe the Municipal Code
prohibits the design created by Lee to solve the shadowing
problem. I have written to Bill requesting a formal
determination on that issue. You will find a copy of my letter
to Bill attached hereto. If off-site private wells are
prohibited, there is no ~option other than to apply to DEC for a
public well permit since it is impossible to put private on-site
wells on Lots 12 and 13.
I.Ir. Bruce E. Erick. ~
Private Wells -Reed Subdivision
April 4, 1986
Page 3
There is also the question raised by DEC whether three
wells five feet apart that go to the same depth really constitute
a public well. Jim Hayden of your office was going to pursue
this question and provide us a written explanation. We pointed
out that there are many examples of private wells that all tap
the same acquifer (called a "public water source" by the
September, 1985 Attorney General's opinion). Presumably, not all
wells drilled into the same "public water source" are public
wells. There are also many examples of private on-site wells
where the driller drilled on one side of a lot line and then
pulled the rig a short distance across the lot line and drilled
another well into the same "public water source". The presence
of a surface boundary line should presumably not affect your
conclusion whether these two separate wells are private wells or
one public well. I think the decision about what constitutes a
public well should be very carefully made unless DEC suddenly
wants to convert a lot of private wells into public wells.
My understanding from both you and Bill Mans is that it
will take some time to obtain the necessary clarifications and
that, in the meantime, neither DEC nor DHHS will stir up
unnecessary anxiety in the property owners or financial
institutions affected.
After the necessary clarifications have been obtained,
we will then know what our choices are. They appear to be to
apply to the Municipality for three separate private well permits
or to apply to the State for a public well permit covering all
three wells. Of course, I do not waive the right to assert the
validity of the current permits, but that is a position of last
recourse at this time.
Regardless of which type of permit is finally obtained
for these wells, some safety issues raised by Steve Eng in his
letter dated March 27, 1986 also need to be addressed. A copy of
his letter is attached. It identifies two concerns:
drainage toward the wells, and
danger of the wells being struck by vehicles.
We agree that these concerns should be researched and resolved.
If there is, in fact, a ponding problem, it may be necessary to
raise the ground level around the wells. We know that the road
maintenance crews have plowed the road onto Lot 14's property
and, therefore, unreasonably close to the wells. It may be
Mr. Bruce E. Erick~ n
Private Wells -P~eed Subdivision
April 4, 1986
Page 4
necessary to erect a barricade or markers to indicate the
property line and protect the wells. As can be seen on the
attached as-built, the wells are at least 5 feet in from the
property line. Neither plows nor snow from the road should be in
that 5 feet. We will be looking into these two areas of concern
while DEC and DHHS are obtaining answers to their respective
questions.
I would like to stress that the wells on Lots 12, 13 and
14 Were designed and constructed in good faith after consultation
with DHHS and DEC and pursuant to permits issued by DEC. The
houses on Lots 13 and 14 and all of the wells and septic systems
were constructed in reliance on those permits. A great deal of
money and numerous people's well-being are at stake here° Mr.
Shelden and Dr. Reid have at all times attempted to cooperate
with DEC and DHHS on this well question and will continue to do
so. We hope that DEC and DHHS will similarly act in good faith
and in a cooperative manner to resolve this matter.
Sincerely,
Sandra J. Wicks
SJW/ja
Enclosures
cc: Finis Shelden
Lee Reid, Alaska Environmental Control Services, Inc.
Mayor Tony Knowles
Assemblyman Gerry O'Connor
Assemblyman Fred Dyson
Assemblyman John Woods
Bill Mans, DHHS
Susan Oswalt, DHHS
Jim Hayden~ DEC
Mike Lewis, DEC
St eve Eng, DEC
1370 66
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CONTRO. L SERViC"$, INC:
200 West ~l'3rd Avel Suite' B
ANCHORAGE, ALASKA 99,503
Phone 561.5040
SH[ET NO
CALCULATE[:) BY _JJ ~
CHECKED E~Y
~CALE I ~'
OF
AS--BUILT
I hereby certify that LOT /~- , -DLOC'~
Anchorage Recording ~istrict, hlaska, has been surveyed by me and
that no encroachments exist except as .shown hereon. It Is the
responsibility of %he owner to determine the existence of any
easements, covenants, or restrictions which do not appear on the
recorded subdivision plat. Listed distances prevail and scaling
should not be attempted to determine unshown dimensions. This
survey is not adequate for, nor should it be used for
establishing boundary or fence lines.
LAND SURVEY COMPANY
P.O. BOX 671089
Chugiak, Alaska 99567
Phone (907) 688-4499
/
DISTRICT OFFICE
ANCHORAGE/WESTEPJ;
437 "E" STREET, SUITE 303
ANCHORAGE, ALASKA 99501
June 12, 1985
274-2533
Mr. Finis Sheldon
P.O. Box 67-1087
Chugiak, Alaska 99567
Subject: Lots 12, 13, and 14 Reed Subdivision,
chugiak, Alaska (8521-FA-211)
Dear Mr. Sheldon:
We have reviewed the plans and specifications for the subject project.
This letter constitutes the permit required by A.S. 46.03.720(a) for
approval of the water systems.
It should be remembered that final approval will necessitate the submission
of Engineer As-built Plans and owners name, address and telephone number.
This will consequently mandate that a professional engineer conduct l~sic
inspection of this project so as to be able t~ sign off on as-built plans.
Arrangement for this inspection ark is the responsibility of the developer.
Any future expansion of subject project will require additional approval
from this office.
Sincerely,
SWElmsm
DE~. OF ENVIRONMENTAL CONSERVATION
437 "E" STREET, SUITE ~0~
ANCHORAGE, ALASKA 99501
Telephone: (907)
Address:
274-253G
October ti, ~985
Mr.. Finus Sheldon
P.O. Box 67-~087
6hugiak, Alaska 99567
SUBJECT: Lots 13 & 14, Reed Subdivision, Chugiak, Alaska
(8621-DS-024)
?
Oear:."Mr'. Sheldon:
The Department has received current water, analyses for. the
subject lots and hereby issues the Certificates to Operate
for the water systems. Any future expansion of the subject
project will require mdditional approval fr.o~ this office.
Sincerely,
Michael P. Lewis
Er, vir. or, me nt al Engineer
MPL/~sm
ANCHORAGE/WESTERN DISTRICT OFFICE
ANCHORAGE, ALASKA 99501
274-2533
March 6;, 1986
Municipality of Anchorage
Department oF Health &
Human Services
PO Box 6-650
Anchorage, Alaska 99510-0650
SUBJECT: Lots 12, 13 & 14, Reed Subdivision, Private Wells,
Chugiak, Alaska (8621-DS-024 & 8621-FA-211)
Dear Sir:
Per your request, we have reviewed our files on the subject
properties. In our review, we have found an error in our
review process in which all three properties had been approved
as private systems. Under Alaska State Statute Chapter 80, our
department does not have the authority to approve private or
single family residential systems in the Municipality of
Anchorage. Therefore, approval given through our department on
these systems is invalid.
However, in the case a subject property owner ac nhoosee, they
~ay submit to our office an application for approval oF a
public water system.
If you have any questions, please contact me at our A~chorage/-
~estern District office.
erely,
District OFfices Coordinator
BEE: HPL: pkk
Hike Lewis, A/~DO
Jim Hayden, A/WDO
/
EN%IRONMENTAL
CONSER%'ATION
· i ~ ~,.,'~'
ANCHORAGE/WESTERN DISTRICT OFFICE
437 "E" STREET, SUITE 303
ANCHORAGE, ALASKA 99501 274-2533
~arch 27, ~986
Alaska Environmental Control
Services, Inc.
1200 West 33rd Avenue, Suite B
Anchorage, Alaska 99503
SUBJECT: Lot 12, Reed Subdivision, Private Well, Anchorage
Alaska 8621-DS-024 & 8621-FA-211
Dear Sir:
The Department
seen by the
authority to
Anchorage.
has revieued the subject submittal. As can be
attached letter, our department does not have the
approve private uells within the Municipality o~
The subject property uas inspected by department personnel on
March 24, 1986. We have grave concerns over the location o~
the ~ uells on Lot 14, Reed Subdivision. The uells are in a
¢looded area uhich is in direct violation o~ 18 AAC 80.020.
Surface uaters uere observed ~louing Crom an area uith septic
systems toward the ~ell depressions creating a potential health
hazard. In addition, the location is such that damage to the
~ells can easily result ~rom large vehicles such as a
snouplou. We have serious doubts as to the ability o¢ the
uells to properly per¢orm in their present location. Any
approvals previously granted are rescinded as a result o¢ this
inspection.
Sincerely,
SWE:pkk
cc: Bruce Erickson, ADEC, Anchorage
Jim Hayden, A/WDO
~IOA/DHHS
Sandra J. Wicks
Attorney at Law
608 West 4th Avenue #22
Anchorage, Alaska 99501
(907) ~R~-~{~ 258-6387
Apr il 4, 1986
Mr; Bill Mans, Acting Division Manager
Environmental Health Division
Department of Health and Human Services
Municipality of Anchorage
P.O.Box 196650
Anchorage, Alaska 99519-6650
Subject: Well Permits for Lots 12, 13 and 14,
Reed Subdivision
0~#~. O~ HEALT
~ ~OTE~io
APR ? 1986
Dear Bill:
Thanks to you and Susan Oswalt for taking the time to meet
with Finis Shelden, Lee Reid and myself at the offices of the
State Department of Environmental Conservation on April 3,
1986. I think it was important for all of us to meet with the
various DEC staff members who are involved in this matter, the
details of which are spelled out in my letter to Bruce Erickson,
the Anchorage/Western District Offices Coordinator for DEC. I
have attached a copy of that letter to this one.
I hope that as a result of our meeting all of us will be
working toward a reasonable solution of the problem that will
protect the public health and yet not cause undue consternation
or dislocation to the owners of the lots involved. I believe you
agreed that as long as we are working toward a solution, it will
not be necessary at this time to involve the owners of Lots 13
and 14 or financial institutions that may have made loans on
those lots. I am concerned to not disrupt the lives of the
owners of Lots 13 and 14 and not to indirectly have any
aspersions cast on Mr. Shelden's reputation, either as a builder
or as a realtor. He, in good faith, constructed three private
wells on Lot 14 after submitting the plans to and receiving the
approval of DEC. His reputation should not be made to suffer
because DEC has now decided it did not have the jurisdiction to
issue the permits. If it becomes necessary to apply to the State
for a public well permit, we will involve the owners of Lots 13
and 14 at that time.
Bill Mans
Well Permits
April 4, 1986
Page 2
At this time, before any decision can be made to apply to
the State for a public well permit or to the Municipality for
three private well permits, two issues must be resolved, one by
the State and one by the Municipality.
The State must determine whether the three existing wells on
Lot 14, designed and constructed as private wells to separately
serve Lots 12, 13 and 14, in fact, constitute one public well.
The Municipality needs to determine whether a lot can be
served by a private well that is constructed on some other lot.
We recognize that that is not the normal case, but do not read
the Code as prohibiting a private well on one lot serving another
lot. Of course, it would be necessary to clearly identify the
lot on which the well was located and the lot to be served by the
well. It is also necessary to have recorded easements to allow
access to the well and water and electric lines. All of that was
done in this case.
Specifically, in this case, there are three wells on Lot
14. One well serves Lot 14. One well serves Lot 13 and one well
serves rot 12. There are separate water and electrical lines
from Lot 12's well to Lot 12, from Lot 13's well to Lot 13 and
from Lot 14's well to the house on Lot 14. There are easements
providing Lots 12 and 13 access to their wells and water and
electric lines. By having separate wells, in this manner, there
need not be any coordination between property owners for water
sampling and costs of repair or maintenance. Each property owner
is responsible for his/her own well. My question is whether this
type of arrangement is prohibited by the Anchorage Municipal
Code. It does not appear to us that it is.
Furthermore, as a common sense matter, This situation seems
very analogous to the situation where a building of a certain
size cannot be built on a lot unless adequate parking can be
provided on an adjacent lot. That is done regularly by recording
a parking agreement that acts as an easement on the adjacent
property providing the parking space.
It also seems a matter of common sense, where a lot has been
shadowed by the radii from surrounding septic systems, that a
well be drilled on another lot to serve the shadowed lot. By
that means the lot is not rendered unbuildable by the actions of
neighboring lot owners in the placement of their septic systems.
Bill Mans
Well Permits
April 4, 1986
Page 3
We await your response and the response from DEC so that we
can decide how to proceed. Our preference is to continue
treating the three separate wells as private wells. If the
existing arrangement can be permitted under the Municipal Code,
we will apply to the Municipality for new well permits to replace
the well permits the State now says it issued in error.
Sincerely,
Sandra J. Wicks
SJW/ja
Enclosure
cc: Finis Shelden
Lee Reid, Alaska Environmental Control Services, Inc.
Mayor Tony Knowles
Assemblyman Gerry O'Connor
Assemblyman Fred Dyson
Assemblyman John Woods
Bruce Erickson, State of Alaska DEC
CONTROL SERVICE,% INC:
:1200 West'~'3rd Avenl' · Suite'B
ANCHORAGE, ALAS~ J9503
Phone 561-5040
SHEET NO
CALCULATED BY
CHECKED 8Y
OF
DATE
DATE
·
DEPT. OF £N%'iBoNMENTAL CONSERVATION
4._37 "E" STREET, SUITE 3(:13
ANCHORAGE, A~ASKA
BILL _~HEFFIELD, C~OVERNOR
Telephone: (907)
Address:
O,:tobeF. il, 19S5
Mr-. Fir, us Sheldon
P.O. Eox 67-1087
Chugia:, Alask~ 99567
SUBJECT: Lots 13 & 14, Reed Subdivision, Chugiak, Alaska
(862i-DS-024)
[lea' Mr-. Sheldon:
The Depar. tment has re,:eived cur. rent water, analyses for- the
subject lots and her. eby issues the Cer. tifi,:ates to Oper-ate
for' the water- systems. Any futur, e expansior~ of the subject
project will r. equire additional appr. oval fr. om this office.
Sin,:erel y,
Michael P. Lewis
Er, vi r. or, mer, t al Engi r, eer.
MPLtmsm
ANCHORAGE/WESTERN DISTRICT OFFICE
437 "E" STREET, SUITE 303
ANCHORAGE, ALASKA 99501
June 12, 1985
RILL SHEFFIELD, GOVERNOR
274-2533
Mr. Finis Sheldon
P.O. Box 67-1087
Chugiak, Alaska 99567
Subject: Lots 12, 13, and 14 Reed Subdivision,
Chugiak, Alaska (8521-FA-211)
Dear Mr. Sheldon:
We have reviewed the plans and specifications for the subject project.
This letter constitutes the permit required by A.S. 46.03.720(a) for
approval of the water systems.
It should be remembered that final approval will necessitate the submission
of-Engineer As-built Plans and owners name, address and telephone number.
This will consequently mandate that a professional engineer conduct basic
inspection of this project so as to be able to sign off on as-built plans.
Arrangement for this inspection work is the responsibility of the developer.
Any future expansion of subject project will require additional approval
from this office.
Sincerely,
District Engineer
SWE/msm
,f
STATE OF ALASKA
DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL CONSERVATION
APPLICATION FOR ON-SITE WATER AND SEWER
SYSTEM APPROVAL
Approval of individual water and domestic wastewater disposal systems is offered by the Department of Environmental
Conservation to the public for their convenience. This approval may not be required by the Department, however it may
be required by other authorities,
INSTRUCTIONS TO THE APPLICANT
1. For a water supply system, complete Sections I, II and IV of this application form and attach the following items as
part of your application.
a) as built plans signed by a registered land surveyor or engineer.
b) a well log for all new systems and, if it is available, for existing systems.
c) a photograph of the well casing to clearly show its height and the sanitary seal.
d)a copy of the test results for a water sample taken from this water system.
2, For a wastawoter disposal system, complete sections I, III and IV of th'is application form and attach the following items
as part of your application;
e) as built plans signed by a registered land survevor or engineer.
b) a copy of the adequacy test report (if appropriate),
c) a copv of the receipt for having the septic tank pumped (if appropriate).
3. This application form with the appropriate attachments should be submitted to the local district office of the
Department of Environmental Conservation at the address listed below:
Box 2420 Room 203 State Office BIdg, Box 450
Juneau, Alaska 99803 415 Main Street Sitka, Alaska 99835
(907) 789-3151 Ketchikan, Alaska 99901 (907) 747-8614
(907) 225-6200
Box 1601 Box 1711 Box 188
Fairbanks, Alaska 99707 Nome, Alaska 99762 Tok, Alaska 99780
(907) 452-1714 (907) 443-2600 (907) 8834381
437 E. Street 2nd Floor
Anchorage, Alaska 99501
(907) 274-2533
8ox 1207
Soldotna, Alaska 99669
(907) 262-5210
Box 515
Kodiak, Alaska 99615
(907) 486-3350
Drawer 1709 Box 1064
Veldez, Alaska 99686 Wasilla, Alaska 99687
(907) 835-4698 (907) 376-5038
STATE OF ALASKf,
DEPARTMENT OF ENVIRONMENTAL CONSERVATION
APPLICATION FOR ON-SITE WATER AND SEWER
SYSTEM APPROVAL
I. GENERAL INFORMATION
Legal Description of the Location
Applicant is: (Check one)
~ Bank [--]Certified Installer NO.
~ Owner/Builder
Ii~Sin01eFamily [] Multi-Family ~.)3
II. WATER SUPPLY SYSTEM t~c:¢~r~-I~J~ ~m~ ~,,~' ¢,,, /d/~ -
Source of Water end Containment (Ch~k all ~het Apply) Type of Water Suppl~System Treatment of Water (Check ~11 tha~ Apply)
~Well(Drilledor Driven)~ Surface (identify) ~Private ~None ~Chlorination
~ ROOf Catchment ~ Other (Identify} ~Public (Se~es more than one ~Filtretion ~Mineral Removal
~ Holding Tank family) ~Other:
Well Data-- ~ I
Is dreina~ direct~ away from or around the casing within a radius o~ 10 feet of the well casln~7 a
Date Dr'lied Depth of Well (Feat) Static Water Level (Feet) [Yield (If Available) Pump Rate (If Available)
Separation Distances from the Well Casing to each o{ the Following Sources of Contamination:
Septic/Holding Tank on Lot ~ ~ewer Lines on Lot Absorption Area on Lot
Closest Septic/Hol~ng Ta~k on Adjacent Lot C o~est Sewer Lines on Adjacent Lot alo~*t Ed0e of ~n Ab~orptiomArea on Adjacent L~
If toxic materials are stored on the prope~, including fuel tanks, paints, lubrican;s end other petroleum On Lot On Adjacent Lot
based materials, pesticides. ~unoicides or herbicides, indica;e distance from contaminants to well casing:
~& .... ~0M[ ,-
Water Sample Taken by: Name ~ampler
~ Buyer ~ Engineer
Address
~ Banker ~ Government Official
Water Sample Resulls: ~ Satisfactory- Date: ~ Unsatisf~tor~:UF
-.
[] (Spacif¥ Brand Name 'gLees)
Where Waste i~ Disposed I FreQuency of Pumping
Other (Specify):
[] (Outhouse, Incinerator, etc )
Size [Gallon~) Number of Compartments
JDate Installed
Body of Water Water Table/Bedrock Lot Line
certify that the above information is correct:
Signature Typed/Printed Name {Ti~ie, Reg./Cert. No.,Inst. No. Date
I
NOTE: Must ba signed by a certified installer, professional engineer or DEC Staff.
[--I Existing System
Name of Installer { Date Installed
[] Owner/Builder
No.
Septic Tank Size (Gallons) Number of CompaFtrnents Soil Type or Rating
Type Soi~ Absorption System Dimensions/Size Soil Absorption System Type/Quantity Backfill Material used for Soil
Absorption System
Adequacy Test Results: AdequacyTestPerformedBy:(AttachCopyofReport) Pete Septic Tank Pumped (Attach Copy of Receipt)
[] Pass [] Fail
Minimum Ground Cover over Septic Cteenout Pipes/Caps installed on Cleanout Pipes/Caps Installed on
Minimum Ground Cover over Absorp- Tank Septic Tank Absorption System
tion Area
I certify that the above information i$ correct:
Signature Typed/Printed Name I Title, Reg./Cert. No., Inst. No. [Date
I
NOTE: Must be si~nad by a profession, al engineer.
SEAL
Registered Professional
Engineer
I~ a pla~ v~ew, locate and identify eec' ' the following:
~) V~eli b) All - ctures c) Septic Tank d) Soil
el Surface Water f) Sources of Contamination g) Property Line (Include
hi CIose$~ well on an adjacent property i) CIo~es'[ septic tank on an adjacent property
j) Closest edge of an absorption field on an adjacent property
2. Show distances between the well and each of the other items listed in 1. ~
3. Show distances between water bodies and each of the other items listed in 1,
4. tn a croSS section view of the soil absorption area, identify each component and show the depth (thickness) of the following: "i
a) Soil Cover b) Absorption Material d) Bedrock e) Discharge Pipes
c} Watar Table
ALASKA ENVIRONMENTAL
CONTROL SERVICES, INC.
1200 West 33rd Avenue, Suite B
ANCHORAGE, ALASKA 99503
(907) 561-5040
/
SHEET NO OF
DATE.
CHECKED DY DATE
._: ~.E -"
S~,B.'! .'!c n~ REED
SECI10'4: 18 TC:414E'HIF':
rS~.FT 0F ACRES)
L0~.: · t4
G';-,NGE: lN
BL OCI-:.;: NA
_ . .,-~,~w are, the r.p~ ions aval)able ~c, yo,_, Ir, de~:,.~,ln9 '>'~,L.r s'-~pt, ic
~'..,StFn,, Ch(:,'t, s6 the oFtlor, th~.t best fits your site.
TRENCH BED W . 1)F;:A I N
DEPTH T~] PIPE BOTTOM (FT.
6)RAk;EL DEPTH (f"T.) ,
TOTAL DEPTH (FT.)
GRAVEL~ WIDIH (.FT.)
GRAVEL LENGTH (FT.
GRAVEL VOLUME (E~U. YDS. )
T~qNK SIZE (GALS)
~OIL RATING (SQ.FT,
4.0 4.0
B.O
· 2.5 ,; 17.0
47.0 ., . :~q.O
1~.6 21.5
~i, 000.0 ** 1,000.0
125 125
TANK MUST HAVE AT LEAST TWO COMP~RTMENTS
I certify that: . - I. I am Familiar with the ~equirements For on-site _~e~e~s and well~_ as set
forth, bi the Idun~cipality or Anchorage (MOA) and the State o¢ Alaska.
2, I will instal t the ~_,/stem in mccor0ance with all MOA codes mhd
er, d ~n compliance with the design criteria of thim permit.
%' ~ I ~:11 adhere to al! MOA and State of Alaska requiremen&e for the set bac~
diste~ce~ frop a0y existing well~ wamtewmter disposel syste~ or public
se~,¢erago system on this or any adjacent or nearby, lot,
' I under st a',d that this permit is v~!id for a ma'.imum o~ ~ bedrooms end
¢r,') er.]~rgc.,T, Er, t ~ill requJr'e an addi[ior, al permit.
IF A L IFT ST¢~iON ~S INSTALLED IN AN AREA CO'.'ERE[' B'," ~DA BUILDING CODES,
THEN ,1~ AN ELECTF'~EAL PERMIT AND tNSPECT~ON MUST BE OZ'TA!NED; (2) AS-GUiLTS
. . 14.f [~E AF'F'F:OVED WITHOUT AN ELECtRiCAL. INSPECTION REPORT; Af~D (~) THE
W~' L
ELEE'iRiCAL WORK MUST BE DONE BY A LICENSED ELECTF:ICIAN.
" ~ · ~ / ' ' DATE:
}EF'TH ]0 F';FE
3RAVE~. DEPTH (rT.)
tOTAL DEPTH (FT.
~RAVEL WIDTH (FT.)
~RAVEL LENGTH (Fl.
~RAVEL VOLUME'
rANK SIZE (GALS)
BOIL RATING
.)
4. ,".. (:,.~ 7.5
8.0 4.5 7,5
2.5 20.0 5.0
~7. O ,. 40.0 58.0
2B. 0 .2e. 7 43.0
OO0. O ** 1,000.0 ~* 1,000.C) ~-~
177 177 ~77
TAN,'- MUST HAVE A'f LEAS] TWO COMPAR'fMENTS
?, 1 we ]~ ;r =+ ~] i IP.' ~,:._.-,, ir. E'c.,-¢~, dAn~[¢ (*CCh, al; ~i{'~i:. c,:,.::'e~ a:",,J
. ''- "~'" ' "' pub,
',F A L:F'T E.T~TiC. N IS ]l~;7.:Li. EP Ir4 Al-4 AREA COVER'ED ~"F MOA E:LJTI.DJNC- CODES,
'HE:lc f!l At4 ELE;ZTF~ICAL ~F'I''~ A"41~ ~4SPECTIOf4 MUST EE (31~'t. ' · '
' , L,[.D, [,E') AS-/qJI L
~7LL fJ~'T BE: AF'FS:?~ED Ie]THOdT AN ELECTF'ICAL INSF'ECTION F~E'F'DRT; ANL (~,) tHE
--- .......................... ......
iF'F',. ' m "~l ~ ~ N' 1"~
........
~'~'~'~' ~-r .]_ ..... ;... . . _
_ _ ,.. ~ · , , . Q? . .
........ ~.' f-~:,~ T.~] ~:~,: .~ ~..':.' , ' .
DEPARTME~ /F HEALTH AND ENVIRONMENTAL PROT~T~TION
825 L. Street, Anchorage, Ata~(. 99501 264-4720
SOILS LOG- PERCOLATION TEST
[] PERCOLATION
TEST
6
DATE PERFORMED:_
~ITE PLAN
10
11
12
13
14-
15
16
17
18
19
2O
COMMENTS ~3(~'I n~
PERFORMED BY: ,~ ~)C~
(6/79)
WAS GROUND WATER
ENCOUNTERED?
IF YES, AT WHAT
DEPTH?
Gross Net Depth to Net
Reading Date Time Time Water Drop
PERCOLATION RATE
~ , ikute~/Inch)
TEST RUN BETWEEN
' ,.
4
7
14
'UNICIPALI.TY OF ANCHORAGE
DEPARTMEN, OF HEALTH AND ENVIRONMENTAL PRO'~
825 L. Strut, Anchor~je, Ala~kB 99501 264-4720
SOILS LOG- PERCOLATION TEST
rlON I~ PERCOLATION
TEST
SLOPE
°i
WAS GROUND WATER
ENCOUNTERED? . mC;) L~
P
iF YES, AT WHAT E
DEPTH?
",
Reading Date Gross Net Depth to Net
Time Time Water Drop
~0 ,a~a O~ ·
PERCOLATION RATE //. c~ ,',, ' ' (minutes/inch} -
72-008
INICIPALITY OF ANCHORAGE
DEPARTMEN'r OF HEALTH AND ENVIRONMENTAL PROTE,., ION
825 L. Street, At~, Alike 99501 264-4720
SOILS LOG- PERCOLATION TEST
[] PERCOLATION
TEST
6
6
7
8
g
10
SLOPE
ol
11
14
15
16
17
18
19
COMMENTS~.z~'~d ~[
PERFORMED BY:
DATE PERFORMED:
LITE PL/AN
WAS GROUND WATER
E.COU.TERED~
IF YES, AT WHAT
DEPTH?
Reading Dete Gross Net Depth to Net
· Time Tim Water Drop
PERCOLATION RATE : ' ' ' ' ' ¢~inuterJinch)
· TEST RUN BE'I~VEEN FT.~kND ; FT',~ ~!
r3' ~ I · ' ~ ~, ' , .
, ,: .'."~~Z .... :'. ~ ~
MEMORANDUM State of
DEPARTMENT OF NATURAL RESOURCES
DIVISION OF GEOLOGICAL & GEOPItYSICAL SURVEYS
TO:DLwMBILL WRIGHT : 3-i4-86
688-3555
FROM: LARRY DEARBORN~
Hydrologist
TELEPHONE NO:
SUBJECT:
Hydraulic effect of cluster wells
This writing is in response to your recent request for a brief discussion by
DGGS of the hydraulic effect resulting from pumping a cluster of wells tapping
the same aquifer. Generally, a well cluster implies very closely spaced
individual wells, on the order of about 3 to 10 ft apart. With few exeptions,
the purpose of constructing a well cluster is to monitor water levels or water
quality in separate aquifers at a given point in a groundwater flow system or
a drainage basin. Occasionally, two to four wells may be clustered to tap a
thick aquifer (50 to 100 ft or more) at various pre-determined depths.
Your question, however, was "what is the effect of three wells, constructed
only a few feet apart from one another, pumping from the same depth within a
single aquifer?". Such an extraction system where all wells would be pumped
simultaneously is technically absurd and certainly uneconomical, I know of no
such installation in Alaska. Essentially, if such a cluster were put in
operation, the resulting drawdown would be hydraulically almost identical to
pumping the total rate of, say, three wells from one well. However, because
of their closeness to one another, the wells would most likely perform less
efficiently and, therefore, cause greater drawdown in the aquifer at the well
cluster site.
LLD/j lw
cc: Robbie RobinSon, Municipality of A~lcborage
J iL
~-%/ L . _ . . :~ :/ ~ ~.'" -- -', ~.:,~,II ! : ,::.~ 8ILL SHEFFIELD, GOVERNOR
/ %.*I/''~ _ .. ..~.
DE~. OF ENVIRONMENTAL CONSERVATION / -~"~ '~/'~:,::_.
ANCHORAGE/~ESTERN DISTRICT OFFICE
437 "E" STREET, SUITE 303
ANCHORAGE, ALASKA 99501
Alaska Environmenta] Control
Services, inc.
1200 West 33rd Avenue, Suite B
Anchorage, Alaska 99503
March 27, 1986
274-2533
MUNICIPALITy OF ANCHOP, A(~8
DEPT, OF HEALTH &
ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION
APR 1986
SUBJECT: Lot 12, Reed Subdivision, Private Dell, Anchorage
Alaska 8621-DS-024 & 8621-FA-211
Dear Sir:
The Department has reviewed the subject submittal, As can be
seen by the attached letter, our department does not have the
authority to approve private wells within the Municipality of
Anchorage.
The subject property was inspected by department personnel on
March
the 3
flooded
Surface
systems
hazard,
wells
snowplow.
wells to
approvals
inspection.
24, 1986, We have grave concerns over the location of
wells on Lot 14, Reed Subdivision, The wells are in a
area which is in direct violation o£ 18 AAC 80,020o
waters were observed flowing from an area with septic
toward the well depressions creating a potential health
In addition, the location is such that damage to the
can easily result from large vehicles such as a
We have serious doubts as to the ability of the
properly perform in their present location. Any
previously granted are rescinded as a result of this
Sincerely,
PE
Oistrict E~ineer
SWE: pkk
cc: Bruce Erickson, ADEC, Anchorage
Jim Hoyden, A/WDO
MOA/DHHS
ANCHORAGE/WESTERN DISTRICT OFFICE
437 "E" STRERT, SUITE 303
ANCHORAGE, ALASKA 99501
274-2533
Municipality of Anchorage
Department of Health &
Human Services
PO Box 6-650
Anchorage, Alaska
SUBJECT: Lots 12,
Chugiak,
Dear Sir:
March 6, 1986
MUNICIPALITY OF ANCHORAGE
DEPT. OF HEAl. TH &
ENVIRONMENTAL PROTECTION
APR :i 1986
RECEIVED
99510-0650
13 & 14, Reed Subdivision, Private Wells,
Alaska (8621-DS-024 & 8621-FA-211)
Per your request, we have reviewed our files on the subject
properties. In our review, we have found an error in our
review process in which all three properties had been approved
as private systems. Under Alaska State Statute Chapter 80, our
department does not have the authority to approve private or
single family residential systems in the Municipality of
Anchorage. Therefore, approval given through our department on
these systems is invalid.
However, in the case a subject property owner so chooses, they
may submit to our office an application for approval of a
public water system.
If you have any questions, please contact me at our Anchorage/-
Western District offloe.
~ri un~ ~/~erely'
District Offices Coordinator
BEE: MPL: pkk
cc: Mike Lewis, A/WDO
Jim Hayden, A/WDO